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Shelley Duvall has died

eludwig
23 replies
2d

Just wanted to pop in to say I think she is a terribly underrated actor. Truly a gem. For my money, the only reason that The Shining has any stakes at all is because of her incredible performance! RIP, Shelley.

technothrasher
15 replies
1d23h

The Shining has so many reasons why it "has stakes". While Duvall was definitely an amazing part of that, it seems unfair to deprecate the rest of the creative folks involved in the film.

temporarely
14 replies
1d20h

Even the opening long shot "has stakes". That's an amazing film packed with talent in all departments.

shiroiushi
13 replies
1d18h

Just don't ask Stephen King for his opinion on it.

LtWorf
11 replies
1d17h

I tried to read the book and it sucked. They did him a favour really.

shiroiushi
8 replies
1d17h

I never read the book, but I saw the TV mini-series remake that King was personally involved with and approved, and it was awful.

Personally, I think King's stories just don't translate very well to movies, unless (as with Kubrick's "The Shining") huge liberties are taken with the source material. Most adaptations I've seen of his stories were just bad.

kbos87
6 replies
1d16h

I agree with you with one exception, Dolores Claiborne is a gem of a film.

shiroiushi
3 replies
1d16h

I think there's several exceptions. The Shawshank Redemption was fantastic for instance.

darby_nine
2 replies
1d14h

The Shawshank Redemption was fantastic for instance.

Eh it comes off as a corny and flat depiction of people who might otherwise be interesting. Romantic, but not a depiction of believable humans. And the problem certainly ain't the actors.

sph
1 replies
1d11h

I get that it's cool to dislike what's popular, but I don't think we've seen the same Shawshank Redemption film.

darby_nine
0 replies
16h52m

My criticism of Shawshank redemption is indeed particularly in response to it being placed number one on the IMDB list of greatest movies of all time. I believe people ranked it there as a result of emotional catharsis rather than ranking based on whether a movie best realized its potential, and I think my response is validated: the script for Shawshank redemption could have portrayed the characters as more three-dimensional than as recorded.

I've never read the book, but perhaps this criticism applies to the book as well. King certainly has a tendency to push fetishized characteristics that take the place of earnest characterization. This is certainly true of the Stand, the Dark Tower series, the Shining, Insomnia, Green Mile, and probably many others of his works. This is not an original take. See one popular opinion here: http://strangehorizons.com/non-fiction/articles/stephen-king...

pimeys
0 replies
1d11h

Rob Reiner's Misery and Brian de Palma's Carrie are both excellent too.

batch12
0 replies
1d16h

Thanks! One of my favorite books of his. I didn't know that it was made into a movie too. Somehow I've missed it for the last 27 years.

Hard_Space
0 replies
1d14h

When I heard they were making a movie of Doctor Sleep, knowing that the final 20% of the book is absolutely untranslatable to coherent movie content, I could not understand how they could close it. In the end, they more or less worked around the finale, which is basically a series of psychic battles fought remotely. It's a tolerable movie.

One example of a truly unfilmable King/Bachman novel is Thinner, though maybe it could now be done, at great expense, with AI (there was a ridiculous TV version, though).

I interviewed him, when I was aged 16, in 1983, and asked him about The Shining. He was in a conciliatory mood on the topic that day, but re-emphasized how little he thought of Kubrick's shot choices for the scene where Danny discovers Wendy reading his manuscript.

To that criticism, Kubrick responded over the years that if we had just been jump-scared by Jack suddenly appearing over Wendy's shoulder as she read, we would have felt relief and even started laughing to blow it off, which would have undermined the tension Kubrick was looking to build past this point in the scene.

darby_nine
0 replies
1d14h

I don't think it sucked but it was told, not sold.

486sx33
0 replies
1d17h

I agree. All of Stephen kings’ drivel runs together in his books.

brandall10
2 replies
1d18h

Keep in mind that performance was controversial and possibly contributed to her mental decline, in particular because of the subject matter and Kubrick's penchant for perfectionism. She had clumps of hair coming out of her head from the stress.

The baseball scene alone is famous for taking 127 takes.

maroonblazer
1 replies
1d17h

There's a documentary that gives the lie to the rumor that Kubrick was abusive to SD. I believe that she recalls fondly that the project was challenging but ultimately rewarding.

brandall10
0 replies
22h44m

It's caution using words "rumor" and "lie" as if a viewpoint espoused by some documentary is fact. What I noted above did in fact happen. Someone can decide for themself if that is abusive. I did not use that word. My take on Kubrick is he did what he felt was necessary to achieve his vision and little more. It didn't come from malice or poor character. He wasn't an Aronofsky.

The life of an actor on a challenging shoot can definitely have an impact on their physical and mental health and Kubrick was notably one of the most demanding and meticulous directors. It's just a thing, similar to Elon Musk in business. The results are wildly successful and most involved were likely aware of what they were signing up for, the sacrifices that had to be made to work with one of the most revered in the business and to create high and lasting art. Unfortunately for Shelley I don't believe she had the mental constitution for it.

Also keep in mind that people in the public eye are going to want to craft a narrative when it comes to their own legacy. At the end of the day most would want to be remembered more for their accomplishments than the difficulties that went into achieving them, esp. when it comes to their most culturally significant work.

hodgesrm
0 replies
1d20h

She was also great in Nashville.

hinkley
0 replies
1d17h

Time Bandits. The cruise ship.

JohnFen
0 replies
1d3h

She was one of the true greats. Among my top 10 favorite actors. Rest well.

tocs3
9 replies
2d1h

Rest In Peace.

I met and talked to her a few times in town over the past 10 years or so. She could serve as an example person that needed help (I tried to help on occasion in tiny "help the old lady across the street" ways). Lets remember to try and be compassionate to those around us.

cal85
8 replies
2d

She could serve as an example person that needed help

Why?

Zambyte
2 replies
2d

That quote can also be found in the OP

replwoacause
0 replies
1d4h

Robin Williams impersonator.

noufalibrahim
1 replies
1d12h

I can't help but wonder if good acting takes a more than usual toll on the mental health of actors. I remember reading how Peter Sellers "didn't have a personality except of the characters he played", how Jeremy Brett started to refer to Sherlock Holmes (perhaps his most well known role) as "him" etc.

The need to become somebody else deeply for a short period of time and then revert doesn't seem like a natural thing (though I guess most creative things aren't). Maybe it's the reason why people like Daniel Day-Lewis takes such long breaks between his roles to "reset" himself.

This was sort of portrayed in a comedic way at the end of Tropic Thunder when RDJ's character transitioned between all his roles and the became himself.

noneeeed
0 replies
1d6h

I think for some actors this is very true.

I spent a long time doing stuff in community theatre and I realised there were a number of different types of actors who approached the craft very differently but could turn in equally great performances. Some seemed to be able to simply put on a mask, behave in a particular way and then switch out of it. Others would get every much into embodying the character and needed to spend time thinking about backstories and motivations. The later approach seemed to be quite exhausting when the character was quite dark or troubled.

I have no desire to ever act, but watching the process was always fascinating.

tocs3
1 replies
2d

I did not know her well[1] so cannot really speak to actual real troubles. Still, it easily appeared that she had mobility and cognition troubles. I saw her once at the grocery store and she asked me to go in and tell them that Shelley was there so they could come out and help her.

[1] edit : I meant "did NOT know her well". I hope my sentiment was reasonably clear.

michaelcampbell
0 replies
5h36m

[1] edit : I meant "did NOT know her well". I hope my sentiment was reasonably clear.

Then maybe just edit the text. The HN pathology of footnoting doesn't need to be universal.

bitwize
9 replies
2d1h

I remember her primarily as Olive Oyl from the Popeye movie and the series Faerie Tale Theatre. She was amazing as an actress with a very unique look. Seeing her as a metal and physical wreck in more recent years was heartbreaking. I will miss her, but am glad she is no longer suffering.

knodi123
3 replies
2d

Olive Oyl from the Popeye movie

I recently (randomly!) listened to the "What Went Wrong" podcast episode about Popeye. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/popeye-1980/id15128470...

It was _hilarious_ . But the one thing that went perfectly was the casting of Shelley Duvall. The podcasters said "If you gave god a bunch of popeye cartoons and told him to make a real human version of Olive Oyl, you'd get Shelley Duvall." And Shelley herself said that she grew up being called Olive Oyl, and hated it because of all that it implied- but now that it got her cast in a big budget movie, she said the comparison doesn't hurt anymore!

boppo1
2 replies
1d15h

What did it imply? Unfamiliar.

knodi123
1 replies
1d1h

Skinny, tall, tiny breasts, washboard ass, annoying voice. Just generally not the physical characteristics of a woman who wants to be seen as sexy.

JohnFen
0 replies
4h52m

And yet, TMI here, I always found Shelley Duvall to be sexy. There's a lid for every pot.

dhosek
2 replies
1d23h

Popeye was the first thing I saw her in, and after that, I could never unsee her as Olive Oyl. Personally, I think that movie is absolutely wonderful (especially the “Everything Is Food” number, but all the songs are great).

For whatever reason, the Fairy Tale Theatre episodes are hard to come by. They’re not on any streaming service although there have been DVD releases. The first episode featured Robin Williams as the frog prince with Eric Idle directing.

It was only in the last couple years that I learned that not only is she not Robert Duvall’s daughter,¹ they aren’t related.

⸻

1. Actually, it turns out she is Robert Duvall’s daughter, just not that Robert Duvall.

roydivision
0 replies
1d11h

She was SO Olive Oyl that it's like somehow the cartoons were retro-fitted to her look.

ianbicking
0 replies
2d

I really liked the Popeye movie; I rewatched it recently and still like it. It gets a lot of things wrong, but it gets other things really right. Among them Shelley Duvall.

deciduously
0 replies
2d

For me Time Bandits comes to mind first, her little sketches with Michael Palin never get old.

duderific
8 replies
1d21h

I wonder if she would even be able to get her foot in the door in Hollywood nowadays. She has a very "unconventional" look that doesn't necessarily align with the modern standards of beauty that generally are table stakes in today's film industry. Of course there are exceptions, but you just don't see many leading women that aren't more like Scarlett Johansson or Nicole Kidman.

dmix
2 replies
1d21h

Always a place for Steve Buscemi type characters in Hollywood if you have charm

xeromal
1 replies
1d12h

I love that Steve Buscemi is the baseline for strange looking actors. I'd agree.

sph
0 replies
1d11h

Strange AND charming. He seems such a cool dude to have a beer with.

486sx33
1 replies
1d17h

Her look would NOT get her into Hollywood today. Or the 00’s or the 90’s or the 80’s

Hollywood idealism is whack

xeromal
0 replies
1d12h

Anna Taylor Joy

pbj1968
0 replies
1d15h

Are you kidding? Most of them are tiny and weird looking in person. Have you seen what Nicole Kidman looked like in her 80s Australian movies? I enjoy her performances but now she is one of the strangest looking people I’ve ever seen.

mixmastamyk
0 replies
1d13h

One of the pieces talked about her movie in 2023, The Forest Hills.

jader201
0 replies
1d14h

I was actually thinking she has a similar look to Anya Taylor-Joy, and would have a similar look if she were a younger actor today.

There are definitely actors today to also have an unconventional look, but you’re comparing 1970s unconventional to 2020s unconventional.

I think she would have fit right in today.

mattjaynes
4 replies
1d19h

One of my favorite films. Can't think of anyone who could have played Olive more perfectly. Underrated classic.

JohnFen
1 replies
1d2h

I strongly dislike that movie, but Duvall's performance was excellent in it.

BizarroLand
0 replies
21h25m

I have memories of strongly disliking that movie as well, but I haven't seen it since I was a little kid.

mmmBacon
0 replies
1d17h

Mine too! Saw it about 100 times via the magic of HBO in the 1980’s. I loved to sing I will gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today to my kids when they were young. They are teens now. Still break it out once in a while to their great embarrassment!

JKCalhoun
0 replies
1d17h

ZaSu Pitts comes to mind, but otherwise, yeah.

lenwood
0 replies
1d20h

Thanks, I'm one of the lucky 10k today. This is great and I'd never seen it before.

eco
0 replies
1d13h

Fun little fact, seeing this video is the reason Michael Stevens (of VSauce fame) was inspired to start making his own videos.

senderista
1 replies
1d21h

I have fond memories of watching her in Fairy Tale Theater as a kid, highly recommend that series.

mrichman
0 replies
1d16h

Loved it so much, I spent a month getting it off bittorrent.

mistyvales
1 replies
2d

She was also great in 3 Women (and other Altman movies).

IndySun
0 replies
1d20h

what do you like about '3 Women'?

at_a_remove
0 replies
1d15h

People talk of her acting, which was fine and good, but I think her largest achievement was Fairytale Theater, Nightmare Classics (only four, but a quite good adaptation of "Carmilla" was in the lot), and so forth. She executive produced four of these series, putting together quite a lot of talent in one place. The IMDB credits for some of these episodes are amazing.